Holyraconteur - Storyteller Of Pandora

Ahhhh, still thinking about a Spider and Tsireya friendship because I love the idea of these two just vibing because they get each other.

-) Tsireya becomes someone Spider can breathe around, not literally, since he wears a mask, but emotionally. She's calm in a way that soothes his inner anxiety. He’s so used to chaos and danger and being misunderstood that her presence feels like the calm after the storm.

-) For Tsireya, Spider becomes someone she can be unfiltered with. Around her family and clan, Tsireya is often held to a higher standard. With Spider, she can laugh loudly, roll her eyes, tease, etc.

-) They develop nonverbal signals: a raised eyebrow, a subtle hand motion, or a look that means “You good?”, “Let’s get out of here”, or “I’ve got you.”

-) Spider likes to playfully mimic her voice when she gets serious, and when he does, she chucks a little shell at him. It hits perfectly.

-) They have a long-running competition to see who can sneak up on the other more times in a week. Tsireya usually wins. But when Spider does get her, it’s with flair, like jumping down from a tree and accidentally kicking sand everywhere. They have a nice, long laugh at that.

-) Spider once showed Tsireya Earth stuff Norm kept, like stickers and bubble wrap. Tsireya was obsessed with the bubble wrap, and the two sat together for hours popping it in silence as if in a trance. Tonowari had to pry it out of their hands because the popping sounds could be heard throughout the village, driving everybody crazy.

-) If Tsireya is in a bad mood, Spider pretends not to notice and will immediately start doing something dumb or dramatic until she cracks a smile.

-) One time, they tried to race each other backward just to see if it was possible. It was not. They both tumbled in the sand and laughed so hard that their sides ached.

Spider + self-soothing

@cyren-myadd to answer your questions about this au.

Quaritch wouldn't know if the kid is his. Back in the day, he nearly beat the shit out of Phillip Shaw for messing around with one of his female soldiers. So when he sees this kid with blonde hair, exactly the same shade as Phillip's pansy ass, he jumps to the wrong conclusion, assuming Phillip is the father of this little twerp. He also mistakenly assumes that Miles Socorro must have died on Pandora, because in his mind, there's no way a human child could survive on this planet.

I don’t see the RDA being too interested in who Julian belongs to, either. They're only focused on getting information about Jake Sully’s location. I can still see Quaritch taking Julian out of there like he did in the movie, but it's a manipulative move, not paternal in any way. And even if he does find out Spider is his son, he’d keep that information to himself. That’s a lot to process. However, he does plan on telling him once the heat dies down and Jake is strung up by his feet. Quaritch needs Julian focused, and he doesn't have time for emotional conversations when he's supposed to be tracking down Jake. He DOES start being a little nicer to Julian, but is still being manipulative to keep Julian reliant on him.

As for Norm, he would fight tooth and nail to find his pseudo-nephew. He’d even go so far as to join the battle in search of Spider, which leads to a confrontation with Quaritch, who’s holding Kiri hostage on the Sea Dragon. Before Quaritch can utter a single word about Spider’s parentage, Norm body-slams him from behind. When I say he’s willing to sacrifice himself and fight to keep that secret hidden, I mean it.

Kiri is freed during the scuffle and scurries away. Then it’s an all-out brawl with Norm clawing at Quaritch like a madman, because he’ll be damned if this piece of shit spills the beans and ruins Julian's life. Norm is injured, but he wounds Quaritch badly, nearly tearing his throat open and even trying to rip out his tongue to silence him.

(Quaritch still manages to escape, but whether or not he succumbed to the injuries Norm gave to him is unknown.)

Norm’s uncharacteristic brutality raises suspicion in Julian, who has never seen his guardian act like this. Maybe even Jake starts questioning Norm’s extreme dedication to finding Julian and fighting Quaritch like a goddamned Thanator. Norm stays tight-lipped, but I have this idea where Mo’at eventually spills the truth. She’s not stupid; she’s known for a while that Norm was hiding something, and she bullied Norm into letting her accompany him to the Metkayina's territory so that she could talk to the boy herself and do some extreme mediating. She's allowed this to go on long enough. No more.

She would have a long, serious talk with Jake and Neytiri, urging them to see Julian beyond his bloodline. I’m not sure how that will play out, but questions are answered, and Norm’s relationship with Spider is put to the test…this isn't going to end smoothly, and tensions are high, especially with Neteyam seriously injured.

But I swear this has a happy ending!

After the truth comes out, there’s tension and frayed trust. Julian pulls away from Norm, confused and upset, not just about the lie, but about having the story of his BIRTH constructed and shabbily patched together like an infected wound, and making him believe for YEARS that he was someone else's son!! This isn't just something that can be washed away with a kiss and a hug.

Julian's life was built on a lie, and even though Norm did this for his protection, it still hurts and makes him feel like an impostor.

Jake and Neytiri are stunned too, especially Neytiri, who struggles with the idea of this child, a friend and brother to her children, being connected to the man who caused her family so much pain. Jake feels betrayed, and he and Norm have a huge argument. Norm feels guilty, but is largely unrepentant and says some hurtful things when their argument gets vicious. "So what if I lied! You lied, too, Jake! You lied, and hundreds died! I wasn't going to let Julian hold your bag AND Quaritch's! Everything I did, I did for Julian!" THAT almost has the two go to blows, and Tonowari is forced to step in.

But it doesn’t stay that way.

Norm doesn’t give up. Even with his injuries, he shows up for Julian, again and again, not asking for forgiveness but simply proving, with quiet consistency, that he loves Julian. Neytiri remains distant for a time, but Mo'at and maybe even Kiri bridge that gap. Once again, Neytiri's trauma is real, and some time away from Julian AND Norm is needed for her mental health. It's going to take a year or two (maybe three) until Julian and Norm and the Sullys can look at each other without flinching. Kiri is the only one not majorly affected because she's attached to Julian and sees him as her full-blooded brother. It's the same for Lo'ak and Neteyam, but this information puts them in a really weird headspace.

Imagine Spider having the gift to commune with the spirits of the dead, Na'vi, and humans. Spirits are everywhere in the forest (more appeared after the great battle) — watching him practice his archery, guiding him back to Hell's Gate in the dark, and whispering stories to him. Some are peaceful and content, while others are restless, especially those who died violently or don't know they're even dead.

Naturally, Spider keeps this to himself because he's afraid of being further ostracized. Instead, he decides to see this gift as a good thing because at least he has friends to talk to. He doesn't care if Lo'ak thinks he's weird for talking to himself or staring off into space. Spider sees fallen Na’vi warriors from the past, human researchers and soldiers who died on Pandora, and even little children who perished when the Tree of Souls was destroyed. They sometimes speak to him, asking for his company or to listen to their stories.

Maybe it's not healthy to spend hours alone with just the dead for company, maybe it's not normal that he prefers sleeping outside in the company of spirits then with the living back at Hell's Gate, and maybe he made a mistake venturing off alone to live in isolation because he's found more belonging with the dead then with the living.

Tsireya 💙🌊

calling it now. Spider is gonna "prove himself" in the next film, and the Haters are gonna realize their arguments on hating him are baseless. and half of them are gonna become fans and repeat what we've been saying for years like they're Einstein s d I'm already ready to crash out over it.

been seeing theories posted places that have been said for years that are just straight up common sense by people who previously despised him before the trailer leaks came out.

the next couple years are gonna be rough for us true Spider fans

my main thought is that the ash clan had a full "civilization," they got pompeii'd by Eywa, then they decided they had enough of all that and are angry and bitter and grieving

Their happy moments

twi || FA || inkblot || DA

I've been thinking it might be Jake who brings up the idea of adopting Spider, but Neytiri flat-out refuses. The whole adoption debacle becomes a major source of conflict between them, on top of the fact that Quaritch is still alive and Spider is now breathing Pandora’s air (if the leaked scripts are correct). Neytiri would see this as a danger to her family, because humans would inevitably come after Spider to unlock the secret behind how he's surviving the toxic atmosphere. That would put her children, and especially Kiri, at risk if it's confirmed she's the reason behind it.

Jake, being Jake, would want to protect Spider. But Neytiri would begin to feel resentful and unheard by her own mate, possibly even going so far as to take matters into her own hands, only for Kiri to stop her. That confrontation would spark a huge family argument that ends with Neytiri having had enough of Jake constantly choosing Spider over her. She either leaves to lead the Ash Na’vi after Varang's defeat or distances herself from Jake and the family until he comes to his senses.

This is all just my personal theory, but honestly, I think it would be better for everyone if Jake didn’t go through with the adoption, or if he does, Spider refuses without even flinching. Jake’s never truly cared before, so why now? Things are way too tense. Neytiri is grieving, traumatized, and not in the right headspace to be asked to accept or care for a child she's hated for most of his life. From her perspective, it would feel like a slap in the face, like Jake is trying to replace Neteyam.

She might even feel betrayed by Kiri for giving Spider the ability to breathe Pandora’s air, especially if she believes Kiri acted without understanding the danger. Grief has a way of tearing open old wounds and making people lash out at those they love the most. Whatever happens, it’s going to get ugly before it gets better. And Jake might face real backlash, both in-universe and from fans of Neytiri, for not respecting Neytiri’s boundaries. I can already smell the “Divorce AU” fanfics now, with Neytiri breaking the mating bond (if that’s even possible) and ending up with some OC beefy Recom or Na’vi warrior. I jest, of course, but you never know.

Personally, I want Spider to grow beyond the Sullys and refuse Jake’s offer to adopt him, not because he’s bitter, but because he finally realizes his worth isn’t defined by whether the Sullys accept him. I want Neytiri to finally have some peace in her life without constantly being forced to swallow her pain for Jake's comfort, and maybe even receive some healing of the mind.

What do you think will happen to Neytiri and Kiri's relationship in Avatar 3?

Zoe Saldana has repeatedly alluded to Neytiri and Jake having some kind of conflict in Avatar 3, and the stuff we heard about in the cinemacon teaser gave us further details. Attendees described a scene of Jake telling Neytiri "we can't live like this, we can't live in hate." From the dialogue and Saldana's hints, it sounds like their conflict will center on Neytiri becoming more and more consumed by anger and vengeance due to her grief over Neteyam while Jake tries to talk her down.

I also believe Spider is going to be a huge point of contention between Neytiri and Jake. In Avatar 2 Neytiri threatened to kill Spider to avenge Neteyam (it wasn't just to save Kiri, it was also partially motivated by revenge, remember she said "a son for a son" not "your son for my daughter") but later Jake embraced Spider while his internal monologue also said "a son for a son," implying that he wants to "take Spider under his wing" as the late Jon landau described their relationship. Clearly, Jake and Neytiri have very incompatible views on how to handle Spider that will only get worse whenever they learn about him saving Quaritch. Plus, there is also a scene from the leaked script where Neytiri and Jake are arguing and Neytiri says "if it's so dangerous, we should just kill him" and Jake freaks out. It's unclear because only a fragment of the script was visible, but it seems very likely they were talking about Spider since the previous page had the infamous leak about Spider, and I can't think of any other characters who would make Neytiri and Jake react so differently.

With all this in mind, how do you think this is going to effect Neytiri's relationship with Kiri? Out of all her kids, Kiri is the most humanoid. If what the old script said was true about Neytiri harboring some "secret shame" about having mixed kids, Kiri would probably be heavily effected by that. Plus, Kiri is the closest with Spider. If Neytiri continues to take out her anger and grief on Spider, Kiri isn't going to be very happy about it.

Me personally, I think Jake and Neytiri are going to try to keep their disagreements, especially ones about Spider, private from the kids to avoid upsetting them, but eventually, Neytiri is going to lash out at Spider for something and it's going to damage her relationship with Kiri. Just like what I predict with Neytiri and Jake, Neytiri and Kiri will go through a rough patch, but ultimately I think James Cameron will give them a happy ending and they'll make up, and since Jake and Kiri seem adamant on keeping Spider around, making up is going to involve Neytiri and Spider reaching some kind of peace with each other.

But that's just my guess, I want to hear what other fans think 🤔