I got blocked by an opponent mid-argument on Twitter, which… isn't really surprising. I had the nerve to disagree with a TB stan that holy Rhaenyra suffered terribly for the month or two she spent trying to squeeze sperm out of Laenor for a Velaryon baby, and then jumped on Harwin like he was the last man on earth. No joke, a wedding to Laenor in 114 AC, and the birth of Jace in late 114 AC - and I'm told that poor Rhaenyra thought she was infertile because Laenor couldn't ungay himself.
So since I wasn't allowed to say it there, I'll say it here: Ways Rhaenyra could have avoided the war, or at least won against the greens AND the patriarchy.
1) Pick someone other than Harwin, because are you fucking serious?
Laenor can't have kids? Spend more than a few weeks trying. Unite with him in grief after the death of "good friend" Joffrey and give Laenor time to recover. Afterwards, invite a man to bed to "warm up" your husband. Or ask him to jerk off and finish inside you. Or find dragon seed on dragonstone. Or leave the poor man alone and visit his parents.
Corlys wanted Velaryon's blood on the throne? Let him find a candidate willing to fuck the princess twice - for the throne and for Driftmark. He has a dozen cousins and nephews, man, is it really that hard?
And if you like it, take the boytoy as a permanent favorite and have a couple more children, apparently this is your hobby or something.
Yes, it sounds horrible and dehumanizing, like breeding show dogs (which I consider as animal cruelty, by the way), but that's the nature of arranged marriages, especially in Westeros. If the goal is to have babies that look like Velaryons, there are other ways than sleeping with the most fisrt man-looking human alive.
2) Do you have heirs? Make convenient marriages!
Now that Alicent can't find fault with your babies' looks, betroth the boy to Helaena, or the girl (if you have one) to Aegon. Either way, green blood will be on the throne, and Otto can stop his shitty scheming.
Or, if you don't like that option, make arranged marriages. Since there's no need to appease the Velaryons by marrying Jace to Baela, and Luke to Rhaena, you have two excellent sons to trade with. Baratheon has plenty of daughters - the Stormlands are yours. The Lannisters have daughters too - the Westerlands are ready for an alliance.
And in the end the greens are left with a part of the Riverlands and the Reach - well, let them fight you, it will take about a week or two to win.
3) Daemon as a lover? Why not. As a husband? Never, fucking, ever in my life.
Laenor can live, considering that there is no need for his fake death - after all, your children are Velaryons, aren't they?
Uncle is hot as hell, but considering that he is the reason you were named heir in the first place - let him stay in your bed, and not claim the crown and the title of king consort.
4) Dragonstone? No need, I'm fine here.
Yes, you are the princess of Dragonstone, that's true. And you have every right to go there and learn to rule. But when your stepmother is plotting and trying to put a reluctant son on the throne, why make her life easier?
Visit Dragonstone as much as you want, but make it clear that your place as heir and next queen is by your father's side, helping him, learning to rule, and keeping your finger on the pulse.
5) Learn to lie, or remember that greens are related to you too.
Aegon never wanted to be king until he was reminded that Rhaenyra was a danger to his family. So don't give him reason to think so.
You may not like greens and you have every right, but creating enemies from scratch, only to fight them twenty years later, sacrificing children, dragons, allies, and the crown - why?
6) The Dance of Dragons? Seriously?
Aegon doesn't want to be king, and he won't be talked into usurping it, knowing his older sister wouldn't hurt him or his family. If Jace is betrothed to Helaena, Otto won't mind if not his grandchildren, but his great-grandchildren take the throne. No one can stand against you, the first queen of Westeros with powerful alliances in the North by oath, the Vale by blood, the Stormlands and the Westerlands by children's marriage.
You win, Rhaenyra, wear your crown with pride.
Oh, wait, that's not how it's happened in canon. Well, shit.
dear diary my teen angst bullshit has a body count
The problem with this show are not the characters or how the episodes are made,but the writers that decided to develop a literal masterpiece into a circus.
The campaign for season two literally started with making the audience choose between team black and team green:we had two trailers,two official posters and even the actors were “divided” to promote their teams.
So they basically told us to pick a side since the beginning.
Then they procede to turn team black in the saint team:making them the victims of the patriarchy,the heroes of the story.They showed us team black as if they are more Targaryen then the other team only because they know a prophecy and use this fact to excuse them from anything they do.
They made team black loved and worshiped by the small folks after Rhaenys killed hundreds of them during her dumb and useless girl boss scene and after Rhaenyra starved them.When in the book the small folks hates Rhaenyra and her incompetence,they will literally kick her out of the city and she has to run away or they will kill her just like they did with the dragons.The small folks instead loved team green,they loved Helaena as their queen and blamed and hated Rhaenyra for her death.
They forced use to like Rhaenyra just because she is one of the main characters,pushing on her the role of strong female character that is fighting a male society and then again just because she is a woman she is excused for everything that she does.We had to sit and watch two scenes of her giving birth and two of her weddings because we needed to empathize with her.We need to see her on her dragon constantly so that we can see Daenerys resemblance.They had to make her a saint,of course she wouldn’t want to kill a child she is too good,she would never hurt Helaena,everyone is loyal to her and she can do no wrong.They even took down Nettles to not show us Rhaenyra racism and the way she wanted to have a little girl killed because her pedo uncle-husband was rumored to be her lover.
On the other side we have team green that was completely dehumanized,stripped down of every good aspects they had in the book,changing and canceling everything.
We had never saw Alicent give birth to children that came to her out of marital rapes,we also did not see her getting married as a child bride to a man that will abuse her.Apparently the love of her life is Rhaenyra instead that her own children,she betrays them and her own side of the family in favor of her ex best friend that didn’t do anything to help her in the past and instead laughed in her face about her trauma.They keep telling that Alicent has never sacrificed anything when she has sacrificed her all life for duty and family unlike Rhaenyra.
Healena is totally marginal as the “weird bug girl” that just rants things out.She was a dragon rider that enjoyed being with her dragon Dreamfyre,yet in the show apparently she doesn’t like that.Even her dragon legacy was taken by team black,because now Dany dragon eggs comes from Syrax.In Viserys last days Helaena used to visit her father with her children but again this was taken from her and put on Rhaenyra instead.She was also stripped down of her coronation,of the way she was loved as a queen and how Aegon made sure that she was remembered as the true queen during the dance.They took from her the grief and mourning of her son one of the things that will literally drove her to death,because only Rhaenyra can cry her son and no one else.
Aegon was transformed into a rapist,because you can’t like him,you can only like Rhaenyra.There was no scene of him and Sunfyre beside the battle of Rook’s Rest,they have the strongest bond between a dragon and a dragon rider,he loved Sunfyre to the point he changed the family sigil to a golden dragon.They took down his will to fight,his family support and loyalty to him,his rage as a father that had lost his son.They took two of his sons,because Maelor do not exist and now he can’t have any more children because in the show he had lost his penis.They made him useless and pushed him on the sidelines in his own story.
I still don’t understand why they had to make Aemond betray his brother when in the book he was loyal to him,also in the book there was no indication of Aegon bullying him so again i don’t understand why choose this path.Daemon had a “redemption arc” after his betrayal one but of course Aemond can’t,only team black can.
Criston Cole is portrayed as an angry incel that still hates one woman that coerced him into having sex with her after he told her no multiple times.So much wasted potential in this character,when in the book he was one of the masterminds of team green,convinced Aegon to take the crown,took care of Sunfyre and served his king just right.
Daeron…sorry who?What do you mean that there is a third brother?I just know that his character will be completely destroyed,he probably will be a bastard with dark hair and we already won’t have the Maelor storyline for him,we definitely won’t see him making Ser Hugh and Ulf change sides or any of his victories with Tessarion.He will probably be marginalized like he already is,because again you can only like team black and only them can have the best.
How can you “pick a side” like they desperately want you to do,when they do shit like this?Literally forcing you to like team black because they are paint as the saints/good guys and assassinated every good thing about team green?
Keep telling me that this show is not team black propaganda and that’s is fair like this.
I don't know if I'll find any supporters, but this has been driving me crazy for three years now, and I have to say it.
The scene from season one with Luke and Rhaenyra where Luke expresses his insecurities as the heir to Driftmark is bullshit, and a litmus test for what's wrong with this show.
It all starts out relatively normal, with Luke again expressing his insecurities as the heir of Driftmark and offering to give the position to someone else, and this personally pisses me off because Luke could have said this at any time, there was a whole trial about it, but it's ok, at least kid gets some kind of personality, cool.
And then fucking Rhaenyra goes on about how she realized that ruling takes work, and she had a duty and must earn her inheritance. Like she's ever done anything unselfish in her life, really.
And then that line. No, not like that. THAT FUCKING LINE. Luke, breathlessly muttering, "I'm not like you. Not so perfect."
OH MY FUCKING GOD I HATE THIS SHIT SO MUCH
That sounds just as fake and useless as half of TB's lines extolling Rhaenyra's greatness, because God forbid we forget for a second that that woman is about to be canonized by Twitter any day now. TB's characters are underdeveloped, they feel fake and hollow, designed to kiss the ass of the one woman the audience is allowed to love, because if you like anyone else, you're obviously sexist and deserve to be publicly humiliated.
Luke is already an unpleasant little shit, he hasn't shown a single redeeming quality. He's selfish, arrogant, spoiled, and privileged even among royalty. And you take away his two miserable minutes of screen time to praise Rhaenyra again, and remind us that it turns out she actually sacrificed and worked for something in her life, and didn't just expect things to go her way because she's daddy's special girl. And she's perfect. Perfest, perfect, perfect. Love her right now, or you will be canceled on every social media.
Those two minutes should have gone to Luke and Rhaena. That's his fiancée, for God's sake! Those two haven't said a single damn thing to each other! Instead of whining about Driftmark again, let Luke comfort Rhaena when she expresses her concerns about the upcoming marriage - at least then I'll know he cares about his betrothed!
But no, that would be too complicated. Instead, we have someone praising Rhaenyra again, because what if not everyone realized that she's *gasping* perfect.
Rewatched Viserys dinner speech and Alicent and Rhaenyra look sad and like they believe him. Aemonds not even listening because he stopped thinking of him as anything to him the night he lost his eye. Aegon and Deamon look at him with doubt and irritation when he says he loves them all so dearly and apparently Haleana does too but her shot was cut.
The only people listening carefully are Rhaenyra and Daemons kids because they have been living in I’m so sheltered land for the past 6 years on Dragonstone and they believe his words at face value.
Also luke started that dinner fight. Aemond was literally staring into space and luc started laughing at him rudely. I loved the fight sequence because Aegon stopping luc and baela from intervening was like no 4 on 1 this time bitches let’s see how Jacey can do 1:1. Aegon clearly did feel guilt for the night Aemond was maimed weather his mother shamed him or not.
Team Green kids are mad but god damn are the Team Black kids spoiled entitled brats.
IT'S SAD AEMOND HEAD CANNON TIME!
After surviving an infection that nearly killed him after the loss of his eye, Aemond is content with just wearing his eyepatch. Helaena made it for him and he's slowly getting used to his new way of life. However when Viserys eye starts to show signs of rot the Maester's aren't convinced that Milk of the Poppy will enough to ensure the safe removal of the Kings eye without causing irreparable damage. So they need a guinea pig and Viserys is quick to agree to their suggestion that it would be best for everyone if his middle son go through the procedure first. The scar and the eyepatch are too distracting and a constant reminder that because of his wife temper tantrum at Driftmark, he never gets to see his beloved daughter or grandsons anymore. Plus it will be good for the boy to look a bit more normal when the time comes to find him a wife.
Aegon is still too young to be taken seriously as King should anything happen to Viserys so Otto starts planting the seeds with Alicent that Aemond having a false eye fitted can only be a good thing for him. Think of how many marriage proposals he'll get with two eyes rather than that big, ugly scar. However Alicent remains unconvinced having almost lost Aemond the first time around and is insistent that any lady worthy of marrying her son would see past his facial scar and missing eye.
Thinking the matter settled, she's the Queen after all, she travels to Old Town to see Daeron only to find an ashen Aegon waiting for her when she gets back. The Maester's came for Aemond the moment her carriage was on the road and in a surprise to nobody, Milk of the Poppy was barely enough to dull the pain and Aegon had to listen to his little brothers screams of agony as they cut through the scar tissue. The only saving grace was that he managed to convince the Maester's to fit Aemond with a bright blue sapphire eye instead of the ugly wooden one they'd made.
In the end Viserys didn't even need to have his eye removed as it shrivelled and rotted out of its socket on it's own and every time Alicent looks at that bright blue gem, she's reminded that she and her children are completely on their own.
Aemond is my closest blood and our best sword. I welcome him.
AEGON II TARGARYEN and AEMOND TARGARYEN in HOUSE OF THE DRAGON
The way TB stans talk about Syrax and Rhaenyra is worthy of a page on the TV tropes. Because it borders on animal abuse, but somehow she's considered the Mother of Dragons 0.5???
The way Rhaenyra treated Syrax suppressed her predatory instincts and led to a sad but expected fate. A dragon that refuses to hunt on its own, only flies in good weather, wears a cute collar, and completely incapable of living on its own? That's a dead dragon. It's expired like a store-bought blueberry, that start molding the second you put it in the fridge.
It's like those ungodly fat cats on TikTok who roll around their apartment from bowl to litter box while their owners film them giggling and the comments are full of "OH LAWD HE COMIN". Yeah, the silly cat eats 24/7 and happy about it, but his joints and heart are about to give out, and his existence is limited by the floor, because only a bodybuilder can lift him onto the couch.
It's like that Reddit post with the girl who talked about how snakes are actually loving and sociable, because her dead pet snuggled up to her all the time, until someone responded that the snake wasn't showing affection, but was simply trying to keep warm, and died early because op froze her pet to death. Snakes are just not the type of animals that you can carry around in your pocket like monkey noodles, no matter how much you want to.
So Syrax's death was predictable. If it were not for her missing survival instincts, because of which she went down to the rioting crowd, attracted by the smell of blood, she would have died later, because the fugitive queen would not have been able to buy her favorite goat meat, and Syrax lacked the hunting instinct. Or this mighty dragoness would have died from the teeth of the half-dead Sunfire upon arrival at Dragonstone, because her fighting instincts had also atrophied.
Dragons are a reflection of their riders. And Syrax was not a warrior, no matter how much you wanted the opposite.
"I don't think he was the sole reason they had Alicent hand KL over to Rhaenyra but he was most likely one of the reasons."
Alicent Hightower is the poster girl for Team Green, since the first season HotD has always advertised the show as Alicent vs. Rhaenyra rather than Aegon II vs. Rhaenyra I so there would have been a lot of reasons to pull the rug from under the audience and have her switch sides. It would have been discussed at length, weighing out pros and cons, deciphering how best to do it etc. It wasn't a last minute decision, they would have put thought into this.
At the end of the day all roads lead back to Rhaenyra Targaryen and their refusal to make even slightly morally grey.
So the reasons they had Alicent betray Team Green:
Rhaenyra the Cruel
Helaena's suicide
Rhaenicent
Jace
They hate Alicent
They love Rhaenyra
Rhaenyra the Cruel: they've already used this name in 2x02 with the purpose of showing it was undeserved, Rhaenyra had nothing to do with B&C so how could the people give her such a horrible name? 😢 But as we know she was given this moniker for raising taxes as the Greens hid all the gold and even after being mutilated by the torturers Tyland Lannister refused to tell them where the gold was. By having Alicent betray the Greens all blame will be placed on her because she should've known this was their plan. I bet they'll even have her suggest raising the taxes and thus be called "Alicent the Wicked" instead.
Helaena's suicide: her son was violently decapitated in front of her leaving Helaena an emotional wreck. Once Rhaenyra seizes Kingslanding she'll be forced to play nice with her son's killers, worsening her mental state. In the books what ended it for Helaena was Myseria telling her Maelor's dead, he doesn't exist in the show so it will probably Daemon cruelly telling her Alicent's the reason Rhaenyra's on the throne. Finding out your own MOTHER colluded with your son's executioner is enough to tip anyone over the edge, and that's exactly what's going to happen. Helaena's suicide now has nothing to do with Rhaenyra, it's all because Alicent betrayed her.
Rhaenicent: well this is an obvious one, they're obsessed with this ship and for some dumbass reason think this is what viewers want. If they have to destory George's work to force this doa relationship to work then so be it!
Jace: I don't think this was the no.1 reason simply because even if Alicent didn't betray the Greens they can still have Rhaenyra seize Kingslanding without Jace dying, he doesn't have to be the trigger. That being said, when they were having the brainstorming sessions I'm sure this came up as one of the justifications for the change. Pretty boys make money, and he's all Team Black has in the pretty boy department.
They hate Alicent: it cannot be said enough, never in my life have I seen writers hate half of a ship so much, it's so peculiar to me. So they've reduced her to nothing, she's lost her fanbase and every single positive character trait, she's been downngraded from Queen Dowager to Rhaenyra's "pet". Her existence is a neverending punishment for daring to turn on Queen Rhaenyra I Targaryen, she needs to be humbled and degraded! Now she's the reason Otto's executed, Gwayne's killed and Helaena commits suicide, everything that happens to Team Green is solely her fault because she's a traitor.
They love Rhaenyra: Rhaenyra must be 100% perfect, to suggest otherwise is blasphemy! Forget about morally grey, they can't even make her off-white because she has to be pure with no real flaws. Episode 8 was all about Alicent being humbled and the writers reminding the audience why Rhaenyra is 100x better than her awful stepmother as both a mother and a Queen.
You breakdown perfectly. 💯
What better way to break team green as valid choice than break the head of it?
If the show wasn't bias as claim to be they would make Alicent the one that pushes and plan things with Aegon like the books hint at. Even Aemond betrayal is more forgivable when you put into context the parallels between him and Daemon.
But Alicent? She is the front figure they use to promote tg and then destroying her breakdown all the base for tg. Humiliating her, means humiliate team green. Making her betray her own faction and saying nothing of this matter, makes any team green claim invalid.
Now there is only one claim that is some what valid, and a bunch other people with their own agendas.
love calling men pretty. ur not 'handsome' ur the prettiest little princess i ever did see
Once I started, I can't stop. Can someone explain to me how exactly Addam managed to ride Seasmoke?
I mean, in canon (I mean the book, it's the only source I'll accept, the show is just a hotd-edition adaptation of "My Immortal"), Addam and Alyn are unconfirmed bastards of Laenor, and Addam being able to ride a dragon supports that theory. Of course, Martin wouldn't be Martin if he didn't also give us Nettles with her dubious origins, leaving us wondering if she really does have a drop of Targaryen blood in her veins, or if she's just a girl who managed to ride a dragon through friendship magic and sheeps bribery.
But the show is actively convincing me that you absolutely need to have at least Ariana Grande as a great-grandmother (or Aeriana Targaryen, I'm not sure, all I remember after Rhaenyra found Steffon Darklyn's fanmade family tree is my hysterical howl) to even look at a dragon, and even then the dragon can have a fetish for handsome black men (I understand you, Seasmoke, Addam is fucking gorgeus), and the dragon chooses its own rider (hello to those who were foaming at the mouth while yelling that Aemond stole Vhagar, I see you and you're annoying me).
Corlys hasn't had Targaryen blood for at least the last 130 years. We've known every Targaryen since the Conquerors, and almost everyone since Daenys and Gaemon. If Lord Velaryon ever married a Lady Targaryen, it was at least 200 years ago.
Was this hint of dragonrider blood enough for Seasmoke? Then why look for dragon seeds with nearest Targaryen parent in family tree, just rake out the entire population of Flea Bottom, every third person will have about the same amount of dragon blood in their veins.
If the purity and quantity of Targaryen blood is not important at all, why this prophecy "from my blood the promised prince will be born"? Why fight so fiercely for the dynasty, when any peasant whose great-great-great-great-grandmother was once graced with the attention of some Maegon Targaryen can mount the Cannibal and go deal with the Night King, especially since their help is not needed, Arya Stark can handle it herself.
What is Rhaenyra fighting so hard for when the show has made it clear that she doesn't want power because power is a dirty toy for despicable men, and she is the Gods-chosen Dragon Queen who is above worldly pleasures and blood doesn't matter if you're pretty, morally simple enough for ten-year-olds to empathize with, and can pose for trailers?
Now I'm starting to sound like a purist, disgusting. But unfortunately, that's how ASOIAF works, so I need answers. Please.
Ps. Still not native speaker and dgaf about mistakes, english can suck my imaginary dick